The Lamp

Where truth can be shared.

What does God have to say?

Posted by thelamp on April 8, 2007

I was at a local dealership getting my vehicle repaired.  While talking to the Service manager, I noticed a quote on his desk from Joel Osteen.  I was very disheartened by what I read as it is totally unBiblical (I am willing to debate this issue).  The quote on his desk calendar stated, “It’s God’s will for you to live in prosperity instead of poverty.  God wants us to prosper financially, to have plenty of money, to fulfill the destiny He has laid out for us.”  I knew this was wrong…but I only kept it in the back of my mind, until I read something that–made me feel guilty for my many blessings (although I don’t have a lot)–and bothered me with what our buddy Joel said.  The following is quoted under permission of Voice of the Martyrs.  Just when you think you’re hot stuff in God’s eyes, just remember who He is really moving through.  It may be a bit long…but more worthwhile to read than the stuff you may hear tomorrow at your church.

“‘Salavat’, a pastor in the predominantly Muslim nation of Uzbekistan, has been detained and interrogated by police so many times he has lost track of the number.  He has been beaten and threatened with long prison terms.  When our VOM workers met with him, he had just been released from a six-month imprisonment.

‘While I was in prison, the eight other prisoners in my cell were ordered to beat me.  I thought they would kill me, but the Lord protected me.  They didn’t even touch me.’

While Salavat spent those six months in prison, there was no caring for his wife “Inez” and for their five children.  The Christians were too frightened to assit the family for fear they also would be arrested.  They were too frightened to get word to VOM or others in the outside world who would have been willing and able to help.  So, Salavat’s family barely subsisted, often going without.

When Salavat returned home, the situation was not much better.  None of the believers would come to Salavat’s church.  They were too afraid.  Salavat was discouraged, but preached anyway.  For two days Salavat praised the Lord in his empty church.  He says he remembered the verse in Hebrews 10:34, ‘for you had compassion on me in my chains, and joyfully accepted the plundering of your goods, knowing you have a better and an enduring possession for yourselves in heaven.”  Salavat decided if his enemies wanted to take everything from him, he would joyfully accept their plundering. 

The imprisonment, the plundering of his goods, the abandonment by other believers–these he could accept.  However, the hardest to accept was his family’s suffering.  There was very little food and no help in sight.  The day finally came when there was no food left in the house.

“Dad, when will we have something to eat?” asked his oldest daughter, 7-year old ‘Rachel’.  Salavat did not have an answer.  Instead, he replied, “Let’s wait until morning.  We’ll have breakfast then.”

The next morning Salavat woke at his usual 5 a.m. time for his daily meeting with the Lord.  Rachel rose also, asking again, “When will we eat?  I’m hungry.”

Salavat prayed fervently that God would provide for his family, and after prayer told her, “Well have something to eat in a bit.  Let’s go out and work in the garden while we wait.”

They began to work, and heard a car approaching.  Two young men approached them and asked for Salavat by name.
“We were not supposed to be here today, but the Lord has sent us,” one of them said and handed Salavat an envelope.  Salavat looked inside and found the equivalent of $200–more than a month’s wages.  The two men turned to go, leaving Salavat in shock, looking at the envelope.  When he heard the car leaving, he and his daighter ran after the men to thank them.
Salavat reached the street, but there was no car.  There was no cloud of dust nor fading engine sound.  The sandy, narrow road revealed no tracks.  It was as if a car had not driven by for weeks. 

Rachel looked at her father, then at the envelope still in his hands.  “Dad,” she said fervently, “from now on your God will be my God.”

15 Responses to “What does God have to say?”

  1. elbesino said

    If the story is true, and not created by editors to make emotional pleas for God, then Amen, and amen.

  2. Zeitlos said

    Hi! I found your post via the comment on system 13 and just wanted to add two short thoughts:
    1. I’m not very surpsrised by the quote you mention in the beginning. If I remember correctly, it originates in the Puritan tradition. You can find similar ideas for example in Benjamin Franklins biography. Or just think of the classic “American Dream”.
    2. Even if I don’t agree with the idea, that economic success is a sign of God, I can’t understand the story you tell in your post. How can someone sit down, pray and just wait for God to help, when his daughter is hungry. Would it mean to doubt God, if he tried to find a way out by himself? I really think God helps those who help themselves.

  3. The Lamp said

    To Zeitlos,
    I do not know if Joel got his stuff from American Dream or Ben Franklin; however, from various accounts I have read and heard of churches in Africa, Iran, Malaysia, etc…I would be rather upset at an American preacher telling me about wealth when I am missing an arm simply because I do not renounce Jesus. It almost smells of who has what priority. Second, I would agree with you to a point. The Bible says nowhere “The Lord helps those who helps themselves”. However, the Bible does point out that he who does not work, he shall not eat. God wants us working, true. God does want us to do His part. In doing so, and by staying faithful to God in trusting Him, He will provide. God provides, but God doesn’t honor handouts. Jesus even challenged those who followed because of that mentality in John 6. But I appreciate your honest opinions.

  4. Philip said

    Thanks for your comment on my site.

    The “health, wealth and prosperity” message is unfortunately being popularized by such people as Joel Osteen. This, as you said, is very unbiblical. The best example I can think of is Job. He lost his wife, children, business and friends, but it wasn’t because God was mad at him. God loved Job, but allowed trials to pervade his life as a test of faith (“My brethren, count it all joy when you are afflicted with various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience.” James 1:2)

  5. The Lamp said

    Amen! The article said the he remembered Hebrews 10:34.

  6. Epiphanist said

    Thanks for your comment on my site too. I have a page where I worked through some of this stuff, have a look around next time you visit. http://epiphanist.wordpress.com/the-cross/god-will-provide/
    In your country your right to free speech is preserved by your constitution. That doesn’t mean that you are always right.

  7. eternalvalues said

    I can agree with the story only partially. The second part is really can be true: if an innocent person is in need and cannot work with his own hands and mind for some reason, God always helps. Though, of course, if you are a physically and mentally healthy person it is you who should be an instrument through which the Divine can make this world better and staying at home and dreaming will help neither you nor God.
    On the other hand, the words “It’s God will for you to live in poverty” absolutely shocked me. How come? Has not God created all this world (nature, animals, etc.) for his beloved creation, the man, to enjoy all this and prosper? Has not Jesus taken all our sins upon himself when he was crusified? The meaning of life is to find God within. Christ’s words: “God Kingdom’s is within!” And what is God? It is love and joy that you grow in yourself and share it with the world and people around you. And if you have managed to do it, you have automatically become a harmonious and balanced person. A really harmonious person simply cannot live in poverty: Life/God will always support such a person arranging many ways for him to do creative things.

  8. Ukrainiac said

    Thanks for commenting on my blog — that is what directed me to yours.

    VOM has no need to fabricate stories — they have any number of true stories to draw from! As Americans, we honestly have had to suffer very little for the Cross — our feelings might get hurt from time to time, or we might feel unfairly singled out on occasion, but around the world… the stories boggle my mind. A young man who recently joined our church here in Kyiv, Ukraine, cannot return to his neighboring country because he will be arrested as soon as he sets foot on that soil — for being a Christian. Can you imagine leaving your earthly family, not knowing whether you will ever see them again, because you won’t renounce your faith in God and His Son?

    Oh, that I, too, would be willing to suffer so for the Cross. I like to THINK that I would, but I have never been put to such a test…

  9. By the way, to illustrate my thoughts expressed in the upper comment I have written about the way to meet God here http://eternalvalues.wordpress.com/2007/04/03/to-know-god-what-to-begin-with/
    And also about the vast amount oportunities that are lying in front a person here http://eternalvalues.wordpress.com/2007/03/27/32/

  10. toiyoi said

    On Joel and Prosperity
    (i) True that material prosperity should never be the ultimate quest/dream of a christian, but rather a complete relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ
    (ii) Also true that God has no problem if a christian chooses to live a life of prosperity, as long as the wealth is gotten in a right way. God gives us freedom, remember, to do as we wish, and wealth is really nothing in the scheme of eternal things.
    (iii)But while (ii) is true, one should also remember that: “But whoever has this world’s goods, and sees his brother in need, and shuts up his heart from him, how does the love of God abide in him?” 1 Jn 3:7
    (iv) Now, while i do not agree 100% with Joel Osteen (I was a member of his church for 4 or so years), those who just criticize him, do remember this: that he does get through to many people who would ordinarily not get into church, and brings them to church (not necessarily his church in Houston) and those churches then have a responsibility to go ahead and teach these people what real christianity is. Do you also witness and bring people to christ as he does?
    (v) Based on (iv), how do you know if Joel’s master (which none of us who criticize him are) set him up to be just “the lamp”, showing and pointing the people to where they should go and receive better teaching? How do you know?

    On no persecution in the American church
    I believe the reason is because the American christians are not obeying their master as they ought. If they did, and spoke when they should and what they should, there is no doubt they will be persecuted.
    Several reasons:
    (i) There is this false notion that America is a christian Nation. What does that mean? (Perhaps it was initially, but it no longer is anymore)
    (ii) The church agreed to receive Tax deductible donations, and thereby agreed to abide by the rules set up on using “public” dollars (e.g. not advance opinions not agreeable to…). They have muzzled themselves by doing this.
    (iii) There american sense of freedom (while mostly good) has deceived the church. Christians fear to tell others they are wrong on issues, since people are “free to be”
    (iv) Back to Joel’s Prosperity: American christians have been ensnared and enslved by their own prosperity! This should tell us that it is folly to seek prosperity as an End to itself. Why, i ask, would i need the Lord’s help if (of course we should never only go to him when in need, but reality shows that what we do),
    (a) when i need cash, i just go the bank for a personal line of credit or use my credit card
    (b)when i need a vehicle, i just go to a dealership and drive off with a new car
    (c) when the “ice cream” flavor i want is not in the fridge, i just look in the deep freezer in the basement
    (d)when i need a house, i just get a mortgage (and thereby enslave myself even more for the next 30 years)
    (e) when i get tired with my kitchen, i just remodel
    (f) when i am sick, there are fine doctors all over, and if i have insurance, i just have to pay $20 copay

    So what is right and wrong? Simple. every christian has a personal teacher, the Holy Spirit, and if you obey the Holy Spirit, you will never be in doubt as to what is right. Lets live by the Spirit, and lets remember to ease the burden of the christians (and others) in need.

  11. thelamp said

    Christ called everyone to witness. This is to tesitfy about what Jesus has done in their lives to help others know Him. Our lives are living testimonies of God’s goodness…or could be. What I appreciate is the reality of those who in other nations fight through the persecution by maintaining their walk with Christ is a testimony that most Christians in America could not compare. However, every testimony of what Jesus truly has done is a testimony. What does that testimony include, a realization that we have sin (I John 1:8-10) and we need God’s forgiveness to be right with God. We also need to TRUTH in knowing that serving Christ will require things of us. Jesus Himself said whoever loses his life for My sake will find it. How? By sacrificing self for others. Sadly, I do not see that in the “evangelism” that is declared and noticed where sin is never preached, hell is not preached, heaven may not be preached because those topics bring extremes or absolutes to the Gospel. Absolutes bring a mirror to reveal our true selves and how we truly compare to the words of Jesus (John 3). This is why we–our church and fellowship–believe whole heartidly in evangelism of not only our cities but every nation in the world…for one reason: Christ’s forgiveness. If we can be forgiven and all Christ requires is for us to tell others, then we ought to do it. But when only 2% ever share their faith, alas I see a failure in the ranks.

    But I greatly appreciate the comments posted for this topic.

  12. Benjie said

    Sadly, I have members in the church where I serve as pastor who love to listen to Olsteen. The “God wants you to be rich” message is not new, but has always been a detractor from the Gospel message.

    Thanks for the inspiring story from VOM. I’ve frequently wondered what would be if Americans had not married their faith to the “American Dream”. Would we really be so at ease in our faith–which requires no real commitment on our part?

  13. Annie said

    Thank you for leaving a link to your blog in my comments. I’ve really enjoyed reading this post and the comments.

    After reading what others have written about the “God wants you to be rich” message, I felt the need to add my thoughts. Like others, I taken aback when I first read this. In my limited experience, those with the greatest faith have usually been those that have had very little (the same people that are usually the first to help you out and/or give you what little they have if you need it).

    One last comment…I was always taught that “God will take of you” though it might not be in the way you desire…and IF you want him to help you, you had better be doing the best you can to help Him help you. If you’re hungry, God most likely isn’t going to be sending the pizza delivery guy with pizza to your door, but he might bless you with crops if you plant a garden. In your post, Salavat didn’t receive his money until he went out to work in his garden. Granted he received money, but when he received it he wasn’t sitting around waiting for it to arrive.

  14. Goldmare said

    I also found this post through System 13, and have thoroughly enjoyed reading it and its comments. I also plan on bookmarking this blog. I will probably blogroll as well.

    I don’t really have anything more to add as far as opinions go, as previous commentors (most notably Annie) have expressed my thoughts quite well already. I do, however, have a story I’d like to share…

    Many years ago, when I was a small child and my older siblings still lived at home, we were in desperate finacial straits. My mom was out of money, and it was going to be some days (can’t remember just how long) until her next paycheck. The rent was too much, but she couldn’t afford to move either, and we were just about out of food. In fact, we had been reduced to maybe a few cans of vegetables in our cupboard. As my mother sat down to a bowl of beans (I can’t remember what the rest of us were eating), she prayed for God’s help. Before she even began eating, there was a knock at the door. There stood an old family friend with a casserole she had just been compelled to make for us that day.

    It’s amazing how God works, don’t you think?

  15. vicki said

    “All things are possible with God.”

    The story of Salavat is wonderful and I truly believe that all things are possible with God. I would love to know when this story took place. Do you know when it occured?

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